Discussion with Will Happer on Temperature vs Radiation Measurement
The discussion with Will Happer recorded in the previous post concerns the question what pyrgeometers and bolometers primarily measure: (a) temperature or (b) radiative heat energy flux. Will says (b) and I say (a).
My argument is that if you look into the design of pyrgeometer, you see that it uses a thermopile, which is a device which reports a voltage which scales with the temperature difference between the two ends of the thermopile with one end by radiative equilibrium taking the same temperature as a distant source and the other end in contact with an ordinary thermometer which can be read.
After calibration you can then from measured voltage and temperature read determine the temperature of the distant source. A pyrgeometer thus acts a thermometer which can read temperature at distance. This is what an infrared camera does.
A bolometer works in a similar way using a sensor with resistance scaling with temperature difference vs a thermal reservoir at constant known temperature.
Will has another conception of pyrgeometers and bolometers:
- Spectral intensity measurements are often expressed as equivalent temperatures.
- But the basic measurement is of energy fluxes which produce voltages or currents in sensor elements.
- Q=ϵσT4 (1)
where σ is the Stefan-Boltzmann constant ϵ emissivity. This gives radiative flux the quality of a state variable, but this runs the risk to be misleading, since the process aspect is forgotten. A correct process version of the PSB Law reads
- Q=ϵσ(T4−T4b) (2)
The confusion increases by letting the pyrgeometer on its display show Downward Long Wave Radiation which is computed from the measured voltage as shown in PS3 below using (1) to express Outgoing Long Wave radiation from the instrument. A pyrgeometer thus measures temperature but reports radiative energy flux by using (1), which does not involve the process. You can thus be fooled by a pyrgeometer, which may be hard to accept if you just have bought one.
My conclusion:
- Pyrgeometers and bolometers do what is physically possible, namely to directly measure the temperature of a source by putting a thermometer in close or distant radiative contact with the source.
- On the other hand, to measure radiative energy flux is very difficult since a whole process is involved with many unknowns and that is not what pyrgeometers and bolometers can do.
- See presentation at Climate Sense 2018.
- The CGR3 is a pyrgeometer, designed for meteorological measurements of downward atmospheric long wave radiation.
- The CGR3 provides a voltage that is proportional to the net radiation in the far infrared (FIR).
- By calculation, downward atmospheric long wave radiation is derived.
This has become so accepted, that even many skeptics believe in what the instrument display shows, although it defies scientific sense. If you have invested in a Kipp and Zonen CGR3 Pyrgeometer, you may not want to hear that you have bought a ghost detector, unless you want to send a ghost CO2 alarm…
To well understand (not get fooled by) what an instrument display reports, it is necessary to look into the design of the instrument by reading the manual to see what is effectively measured and what is displayed.
This is what I did above.
See more here: blogspot.com
Header image: Tallbloke’s Talkshop
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